THE DEVIL STRIKES

I have played the (semi-complete) Chinese fanpatch and I would have to say, in short, yes.

Just a quick question (before deciding whether it's a good idea for me to get this game).

Originally Posted by Unregistered

everyone seems to be of the opinion that only one heroine's route is good

I've also read something like this (on 4chan..). Given how long the game is according to vndb, I'm not certain I have time to go through all of the routes anytime soon, so I'd be interested in knowing how important the sub-heroine routes are in the story. Is there any point to playing the game if I don't plan to go through all of them?

Also, does the game have a lot of very complicated language? I've read a couple of VNs (such as Yosuga no Sora) in Japanese without any translation aids like ATLAS, and had no problems understanding them (other than being a slow reader, but I'm slowly getting better at this by reading more). I know very nearly all of the jōyō kanji and a good amount of grammar, but what I'm worried about is vocabulary, which I'm still working on. It would probably be a bit of a problem if the game had a lot of technical vocabulary, for example.

[tea panda]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I have played the (semi-complete) Chinese fanpatch and I would have to say, in short, yes.

Mind a hookup, bro?

Originally Posted by tea panda

Mind a hookup, bro?

Sure, I'm going to assume you can understand Chinese:

http://tieba.baidu.com/f?kz=549185565

All info / instructions regarding the release is here (If you want to visit the website of the actual group, though, there's a link in the readme. Although I always get a cannot connect, sooo.) The RF link requires the RayFile program, but the Namipan link works DDL style. (Just disregard their suggestion for you to download their dl manager)

Full patch due this summer, if all goes well (Afaik).

^
Same as unreg above

Sorry for double post.

Just as an add-on, there IS also a 0.67 out, however I've found nothing but dead links to that one.

Progress is up to 0.9, which is a test version for staff only so no public downloads.

FULL PATCH release is slated for 05/29. Mark your calendars ;)

[AstCd2]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Just a quick question (before deciding whether it's a good idea for me to get this game).

I've also read something like this (on 4chan..). Given how long the game is according to vndb, I'm not certain I have time to go through all of the routes anytime soon, so I'd be interested in knowing how important the sub-heroine routes are in the story. Is there any point to playing the game if I don't plan to go through all of them?

The game is enjoyable and coherent even if you play just the primary route.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Also, does the game have a lot of very complicated language? I've read a couple of VNs (such as Yosuga no Sora) in Japanese without any translation aids like ATLAS, and had no problems understanding them (other than being a slow reader, but I'm slowly getting better at this by reading more). I know very nearly all of the jōyō kanji and a good amount of grammar, but what I'm worried about is vocabulary, which I'm still working on. It would probably be a bit of a problem if the game had a lot of technical vocabulary, for example.

There's isn't much (if any) technobabble. If you have a standard dictionary, I don't expect you'll have any issues.

[Asceai]

Some of the economic/trading stuff made me pull out a dictionary at times, but that was mainly it. I didn't have any real trouble reading the thing.

unregguy, you seem to be the only one requesting right now, give it up if you haven't already done so. You're starting to annoy me and most likely all others. Asceai can be silent, that's his right, right now it's entirely his problem how he deals with translation issues as far as i see it.
sure, he may be convinced at request 329120235, but by that time, you've had been better off learning moonrunes yourself, do us all a favour.

Tsc, you're making a scratch look like a wound, you also played a part in dragging this out by responding so strongly and talking about irrelevant crap like manners on the internets (oh noes!), when really, you should have just told him to stfu or if that was unsatisfying, addressing what he was saying rather than his demeanor.

other unreg, you assumed an infinite sample size (continuous), but this does not apply to discrete trading which is always limited in a finite time span (therefore not continuous).
doesn't matter in practice however, calculations are essentially the same in the real world.

i loves drama
i loves dragging out people's intestines through their anus
i am even polite about doing it

anyhow, i think he already gave up. please try and read the dates before commenting. giving your views when everything is over makes you look stupid btw

was that "stfu" to your liking?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

other unreg, you assumed an infinite sample size (continuous), but this does not apply to discrete trading which is always limited in a finite time span (therefore not continuous).
doesn't matter in practice however, calculations are essentially the same in the real world.

No, that was not the assumption. Continuous does not mean the same thing as an infinite sample size. In fact, it has nothing to do with samples. When you are in the real numbers, it just means that for every point where the function is defined, the limit exists and the value of the function is equal to the limit. For example, the identity function y = x on the interval [0,1] is continuous. There are an infinite number of points for which the function is defined, but the for any point x on the interval, the magnitude of y is less than or equal to 1.

Whatever the case, the argument wasn't even whether or not the function was continuous. The argument is that you can construct a continuous function that describes the discrete function, and have n e R make sense for the function. For example, if you sell cookies at 1 dollar a cookie, regardless of whether or not it is sold discretely, you can make a function that would describe the value of say, 1/2 of a cookie to be 50 cents. That is perfectly doable, and has nothing to do with infinite samples since you are ultimately interpolating between the discrete values that are defined. It has nothing to do with time spans, because each point you are trying to describe is not its own time span.

If you don't believe me, you should probably figure out what continuous interest is and how it affects your credit card bills...

[NML]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

No, that was not the assumption. Continuous does not mean the same thing as an infinite sample size. In fact, it has nothing to do with samples. When you are in the real numbers, it just means that for every point where the function is defined, the limit exists and the value of the function is equal to the limit. For example, the identity function y = x on the interval [0,1] is continuous. There are an infinite number of points for which the function is defined, but the for any point x on the interval, the magnitude of y is less than or equal to 1.

Whatever the case, the argument wasn't even whether or not the function was continuous. The argument is that you can construct a continuous function that describes the discrete function, and have n e R make sense for the function. For example, if you sell cookies at 1 dollar a cookie, regardless of whether or not it is sold discretely, you can make a function that would describe the value of say, 1/2 of a cookie to be 50 cents. That is perfectly doable, and has nothing to do with infinite samples since you are ultimately interpolating between the discrete values that are defined. It has nothing to do with time spans, because each point you are trying to describe is not its own time span.

If you don't believe me, you should probably figure out what continuous interest is and how it affects your credit card bills...

Holy cow, how can I missed such a great enlightening thread!

Well, joking aside, I think you are mistaken here, this isn't something like a function that take real argument and return an natural number one. This is a function that only take a natural number as an argument and return another.

Originally Posted by NML

Holy cow, how can I missed such a great enlightening thread!

Well, joking aside, I think you are mistaken here, this isn't something like a function that take real argument and return an natural number one. This is a function that only take a natural number as an argument and return another.

Actually, the way I see it is really simple. X is the number of times you asked. The result is whether or not he does release the translation, which can be represented as a value of say, 0 or 1. So say, you ask 3 times and the result is no. It isn't a long stretch to say that if you asked 2.790832409 times, the answer would be no. That imo is a reasonable function that is continuous between each interval of integers of distance one apart that would give you an answer that makes sense.

[NML]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Actually, the way I see it is really simple. X is the number of times you asked. The result is whether or not he does release the translation, which can be represented as a value of say, 0 or 1. So say, you ask 3 times and the result is no. It isn't a long stretch to say that if you asked 2.790832409 times, the answer would be no. That imo is a reasonable function that is continuous between each interval of integers of distance one apart that would give you an answer that makes sense.

Well, we aren't talking about the same function. I am talking about a function that take an integer and return the number of asking times, which, is used to determine the meaning of his sentence.

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Actually, the way I see it is really simple. X is the number of times you asked. The result is whether or not he does release the translation, which can be represented as a value of say, 0 or 1. So say, you ask 3 times and the result is no. It isn't a long stretch to say that if you asked 2.790832409 times, the answer would be no. That imo is a reasonable function that is continuous between each interval of integers of distance one apart that would give you an answer that makes sense.

The problem with this function is that IF the answer at some point ever becomes yes ("1"), what happens then?

Supposing the answer is yes when number of requests, x, is 4.

What is the value at 3.79?

Does the function remain no as it approaches 4, and then suddenly make a gap / jump to yes? (This would be a discontinuity.)

Or does it gradually rise from 0 to 1 (which would make no sense)? If this is the case, what would a y value of 0.25 be? Or 0.7? or 0.8?

This is the problem of trying to represent real-life situations that are not directly numerically related using a mathematical model.

On another note, I like how this thread very quickly and drastically degenerated from the original topic to mathematics from one trolling(?) comment. Epic win?

Originally Posted by Unregistered

The problem with this function is that IF the answer at some point ever becomes yes ("1"), what happens then?

Supposing the answer is yes when number of requests, x, is 4.

What is the value at 3.79?

Does the function remain no as it approaches 4, and then suddenly make a gap / jump to yes? (This would be a discontinuity.)

Or does it gradually rise from 0 to 1 (which would make no sense)? If this is the case, what would a y value of 0.25 be? Or 0.7? or 0.8?

This is the problem of trying to represent real-life situations that are not directly numerically related using a mathematical model.

On another note, I like how this thread very quickly and drastically degenerated from the original topic to mathematics from one trolling(?) comment. Epic win?

It depends on your goal when modeling the function. If your goal is to be everywhere continuous, than there would pretty much have to be some sort of intermediary function between when the answer changes from 0 to 1, since after the switch, all values would clearly be constantly 1.

As I was saying earlier, the function clearly makes no literal sense, in that you can't ask 2.5 times, the same way you don't sell 2.5 apples. It just creates a function that is workable with in between (though for our purposes its not very useful, other fields, it would be very useful to be able to apply, say, calculus, which in general needs functions of domain R and not I). As for us, the only necessary condition of course, is that the function at every natural number is the value that it should be.

How each intermediary real number is defined is subject to interpretation. For example, if how many times you ask is sort of a function of time elapsed, as you get nearer to the release, said person might produce teasers or demos, at which you might want to have a sub 1 value to represent the unfinished product released. Or you might want to just say, nothing is released until it is released and have a jump discontinuity at some natural number (this doesn't really mean anything bad, it just means that you don't have an every continuous function, you still have every real real number accounted for). Anyways, depending on what you are doing with your function, even an infinite number of discontinuities can have no real effect on your function, for example Lebesgue integration can be done on sets with countably infinite discontinuities to achieve non-zero results.

Whatever the case, it was a troll post to begin with, because whether or not something is done clearly has no real relation to the number of times asked. I just felt that math was being used wrongly to flame others. I also suck at math, and find this kind of analysis much more interesting the math I'm supposed to be doing right now...