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General Discussion Theres a Clannad of AIR-headed Kanon fodder being shot by the Little Busters After Tomoyo on a Planet-arian.

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  #31  
Old 2010-09-01, 07:48
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A poorly worded yet pertinent question.
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  #32  
Old 2010-09-01, 07:54
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Moogy's not mad, just misunderstood.
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  #33  
Old 2010-09-01, 07:56
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Unfortunately today's visual novel scene is populated by too many "translators" who have little or no skill in either the target OR the source language. The results are quite laughable.
You say this as if it'd be some new thing which only came out recently, but this is hardly anything new.
Just look at how many people have turned a blind eye to the issue of the translation quality in the genre's most popular translated games like Ever 17, Clannad, YMK etc etc.
Ignoring the quality of the translations has been present for years.
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  #34  
Old 2010-09-01, 09:25
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Moogy's not mad, just misunderstood.
I was going to post a snarky response to add to the semi-trolling here, but I am going to be somewhat serious.

I really don't have a problem with Moogy being an asshole, I'm never going to meet the guy, and his rants are mildly amusing. Gipface, however, can troll circles around him.

This is what I have somewhat of a problem with: There were a couple of occasions where he was talking shit about JAST USA. Once on his blog a while back and once in a thread here on Gemot. Not that I am defending JAST USA, they certainly deserve a lot of criticism, but Moogy has represented to the community that he and his TLWiki crew have been working with JAST USA on Demonbane. I don't know what kind of contractual arrangement exists between him and JAST USA (or if there is ANY kind of arrangement for that matter) but it does speak to his character a bit that on one hand he is being paid by these people to do work and then talks shit about them on various online forums that will be viewed by JAST USA's potential customer base.

Just to make it clear, this isn't out of any great love for JAST USA, I have as many problems with them as the next guy. However, when you are working for a company, even if its a temporary contractual arrangement, it's just not cool to be talking shit about them in public.
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  #35  
Old 2010-09-01, 09:33
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Poor misunderstood Moogy - a REAL TRAGIC HERO.
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  #36  
Old 2010-09-01, 09:35
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@dude above LoSs: But why? I'm seriously interested as to why you think it's taboo to dare to criticize someone you're "employed" for (and that descriptor barely even works here, we're just a bunch of freelancers who get paid pennies for stuff we'd have done for free otherwise anyway). Not trolling or anything, I really want to know why it's some mortal sin to criticize a corporate entity you have ties to. Wouldn't that make your criticism more valid, even, since you know what goes on on the inside?
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  #37  
Old 2010-09-01, 12:46
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@dude above LoSs: But why? I'm seriously interested as to why you think it's taboo to dare to criticize someone you're "employed" for (and that descriptor barely even works here, we're just a bunch of freelancers who get paid pennies for stuff we'd have done for free otherwise anyway). Not trolling or anything, I really want to know why it's some mortal sin to criticize a corporate entity you have ties to. Wouldn't that make your criticism more valid, even, since you know what goes on on the inside?
When Peter got the Nitro+ licence, he could have just C&D'd you and given had the in-house JAST USA translators do it. Paying you to do work you would do and enjoy anyway is a pretty sweet deal in my opinion, then to turn round and criticise the guy who employed you to the very people who might buy his products seems a little two faced.
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  #38  
Old 2010-09-01, 12:47
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When Peter got the Nitro+ licence, he could have just C&D'd you and given had the in-house JAST USA translators do it. Paying you to do work you would do and enjoy anyway is a pretty sweet deal in my opinion, then to turn round and criticise the guy who employed you to the very people who might buy his products seems a little two faced.
Just to clarify, I'm not the guy above LoSs, just my take.
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  #39  
Old 2010-09-01, 12:55
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When Peter got the Nitro+ licence, he could have just C&D'd you and given had the in-house JAST USA translators do it. Paying you to do work you would do and enjoy anyway is a pretty sweet deal in my opinion, then to turn round and criticise the guy who employed you to the very people who might buy his products seems a little two faced.
Are you suggesting his acts are motivated by kindness and not the fact that he's saving a lot of money on translation fees?
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  #40  
Old 2010-09-01, 13:35
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@dude above LoSs: But why? I'm seriously interested as to why you think it's taboo to dare to criticize someone you're "employed" for (and that descriptor barely even works here, we're just a bunch of freelancers who get paid pennies for stuff we'd have done for free otherwise anyway). Not trolling or anything, I really want to know why it's some mortal sin to criticize a corporate entity you have ties to. Wouldn't that make your criticism more valid, even, since you know what goes on on the inside?
The post Moogy is responding to is my post, so I guess I would be "dude above LoSs."

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Quote:
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When Peter got the Nitro+ licence, he could have just C&D'd you and given had the in-house JAST USA translators do it. Paying you to do work you would do and enjoy anyway is a pretty sweet deal in my opinion, then to turn round and criticise the guy who employed you to the very people who might buy his products seems a little two faced.
Are you suggesting his acts are motivated by kindness and not the fact that he's saving a lot of money on translation fees?
I don't think it is being suggested that Peter Payne's acts are motivated by "kindness." But the poster you are responding to is right. Peter Payne could have made a move to block TLWiki from doing any move Nitro+ translations and would have had a lot more teeth than, say a C&D from minori to No Name Losers.

Peter Payne certainly isn't motivated by "kindness." He likely felt having the TLWiki crew do the job was the best thing for his company. That's really not the point.

The point I was trying to make in my post was about professionalism. I don't know what your arrangement is with Peter Payne and I'm not asking what it is; but what is clear is that he is paying you and your crew to do a job or as you put it "pennies for stuff we'd have done for free." I never said criticisms weren't valid either. However, If I am running a small business and I hire someone on a temporary basis and I get wind that this individual has been talking shit about my business to potential customers, he isn't getting hired again. The truth is you are hurting yourself more than JAST USA with those rants and it really isn't any skin off my ass if you shoot yourself in the foot.

I suppose the larger question is, if you are "working" for a company is it OK to go talking shit about that company to their customer base. Obviously you think it's OK. I don't. So I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
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  #41  
Old 2010-09-01, 13:44
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Are you suggesting his acts are motivated by kindness and not the fact that he's saving a lot of money on translation fees?
Nope, I was just saying Peter did something that made Moogy gain money and Moogy did something that might lose Peter money. Hardly seems fair, does it?
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  #42  
Old 2010-09-01, 13:58
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I know that it's not my business, but I'm curious. Moogy is not a translator and it's not like he owns the translations hosted on TLWiki. So what did he get paid for?
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  #43  
Old 2010-09-01, 14:05
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Quote:
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I know that it's not my business, but I'm curious. Moogy is not a translator and it's not like he owns the translations hosted on TLWiki. So what did he get paid for?
Beta testing/Proofing/PR/Misc.: Moogy
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  #44  
Old 2010-09-01, 14:20
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I did indeed translate a few scripts for Demonbane in addition to some editing and proofing. I also helped organize the project in general, along with LoSs, once it went "legit." Gotta give all the credit for the original Al route translation to Makoto, though.
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  #45  
Old 2010-09-01, 14:43
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Paid or unpaid, pro or amateur. Lets set all of that aside for a moment. Let me share my viewpoint.

Moogy has achievements.

Sharin no Kuni and Saya no Uta as well as Demonbane and establishing TLWiki and there are probably others before my time.
To Moogy: A lot of people hold you in a position of respect. You've brought bunches to the visual novel scene and for that we are grateful. But now why are you ranting on other fan translators? Why are you talking crap about mangagamer and kouryuu, about JAST USA? Aren't they all part of this very awesome visual novel community that we've established? And yet now you seem like you're backfiring on everything you stood for (or perhaps only appear to stand for). Look, if you don't care for the industry, then get off the pedestal and be the 4channer you are - that's completely fine. But be done with the elitist talk. And I'm sorry if I get any facts wrong, but these are the things I think I've been absolutely certain of.
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