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Poll: Should VisualNews expand coverage to OELs?
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Should VisualNews expand coverage to OELs?

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  #1  
Old 2006-12-02, 22:25
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Default [Poll] OELs on VisualNews?

So a question to you guys out here.
Do you think VisualNews should expand coverage to include OELs?
It's been a topic brought up a couple times in staff meetings and I wanted to get peoples thoughts and opinions on the topic.
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  #2  
Old 2006-12-03, 03:26
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I thought you already did.

I must say I'd like to be informed of releases such as the above. I do realise that there is a lot of crap floating around, however, so I really don't know.
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Old 2006-12-03, 03:42
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Those two were Message's fan favorites, so thats why he posted them ^^. Otherwise we technically dont cover them yet. This is why I'm asking the community now though.
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  #4  
Old 2006-12-03, 07:36
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Beware if you include news about OELs, both commercial and noncommercial, demos and full games, you could hit upon a very huge number of projects:
http://atp.manga.sk/english/projects.htm (courtesy of mikey)
most of which are unfinished.
I think you can allow Lemmasoft do most of the filtering, since most people on VisualNews would rather be playing JP VNs rather than trying out OELs.
However you shouldn't prevent those who are really proud of their work to do some unabashed self-promotion.
Off the top of my head, Ori Ochi Onoe and Brokenhearted are two complete OELs of professional quality (the others are too short or uncomplete / demos). I think an hours' worth of playtime is still significant.
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Old 2006-12-03, 08:01
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I would like to hear news about only professional or commercial-quality OELs.
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  #6  
Old 2006-12-03, 08:33
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I agree, although we have reached a point where a few free fanmade OELs are easily besting some of the recent al|together translations through better writing and use of original resources such as music and art.

Do note there has been no commercial OEL release yet. All we've got are works-in-progress.

Now what happens when there's a professional quality but free OEL? Right now its easy to pick, but the line might become thinner in the future.
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  #7  
Old 2006-12-03, 08:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Misu View Post
Those two were Message's fan favorites, so thats why he posted them ^^.
Make that "that one" and I'll agree. I posted O3 because it makes unusually good use of the Ren'Py engine, I don't personally like the game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shii View Post
I would like to hear news about only professional or commercial-quality OELs.
While my current stance does boil down to this, it raises the question "who is to decide what is or is not a commercial-quality OEL?" I can keep reporting about titles I think are worth it for some reason or other and just ignore the less special releases, but then I might start doing the same for, say, small doujin translations that don't strike my fancy. My problem is that I'm not sure where to draw the line.

Edit: And as DaFool points out, that line will only become unclearer in the future if things continue developing as they are now.
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Old 2006-12-03, 08:58
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Hey, I'm the consumer. (Technically I write for VisualNews too but I don't edit it.) I can't tell you where to draw the line, just what I'd like to see. (´・ω・`) [s]And I don't want to hear about amerimanga. Probably safer only to report on commercial works, or works that create a buzz outside Lemmasoft.[/s] See DaFool's post below, it's better.

Last edited by Shii; 2006-12-03 at 16:49.
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Old 2006-12-03, 09:13
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Quote:
or works that create a buzz outside Lemmasoft.
LOL. That automatically gives any future works created with the Blade Engine a strategic advantage, due to commercial marketing muscle. And this forum is by very nature Onscripter-centric.

But there is a point. Say there's a minimum set of standards:
Example
1.) All-original characters and stories. No fanfics.
2.) All resources used with permission / license free (should be easier to negotiate for OEL than for JP doujinshi)
and here's the hardest one with the finest line to draw:
3.) Minimum level of professional presentation. By this definition even Brokenhearted looks fanmade due to its simplistic interface. Echoes of Thunder easily wins, but very rarely do even JPs approach that level of interface.
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Old 2006-12-03, 09:22
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How about a simple test along the lines of "if a member of VisualNews staff can be bothered to write about it, it's newsworthy"? :)
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Old 2006-12-03, 13:33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haeleth View Post
How about a simple test along the lines of "if a member of VisualNews staff can be bothered to write about it, it's newsworthy"? :)
Well, I'm starting to like Haeleth's suggestion more and more >.>;;.

One criteria I would have is that the OEL must be complete. I would have historically said yes to the "Must be an original work, not fanfic," but just yesterday we did a first and reported on two translated doujin games that were fanfic.

Hrm... everyone brings up good points ^^.
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  #12  
Old 2006-12-03, 13:49
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It's also probably about defining what VNN wants to do:
- is it a summary page for everything that is of interest to this forum,
- is it a site dedicated to bring fan translation news on Japanese-made VNs,
- is it a site that wants to report on any kind of VN experience in English,
- is it a site that brings "quality" English VN entertainment news...
- is it a site for news about English projects made with Japanese VN engines...
and so on.

Also, I never saw any news on BL titles, there's Kuro No Tsuki, a fan translated Japanese VN, and several others are being worked on, so that's another point - the recent demo releases, I think one of them was BL...
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  #13  
Old 2006-12-03, 13:54
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Excuse me, but I HATE the term "OEL" as much as I hate people referring to the United States as "America".

I can't see why you would instantly reject a piece of software following that line of reasoning.

However, I do admit, most amateur visual novels (REGARDLESS OF COUNTRY, LANGUAGE OR RELIGION, [Offensive content removed by Message] - yes, that was sarcastic) hold value only to their creators, so it is only reasonable that people would discuss only things they find interesting, i.e. worthwhile novels.

(In case I wasn't clear: judge according to quality, not country.)
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Last edited by Claudio; 2006-12-03 at 13:57.
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  #14  
Old 2006-12-03, 14:01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey View Post
Also, I never saw any news on BL titles, there's Kuro No Tsuki, a fan translated Japanese VN, and several others are being worked on, so that's another point - the recent demo releases, I think one of them was BL...
People are always free to submit news to us. We won't quickly shy away from items that deal with BL or even yaoi, just don't expect us personally to spend too much time on researching the subject to get more information... >_>;;
We are not at all unhappy about the number of connections we have developed over the past year(s), but we cannot see or hear everything. If there's news out there that might be of interest to us, everyone is more than welcome to post here or mail us about it.

Claudio, I've edited your post to prevent people from being offended. We would appreciate it if you would not post blasphemous or otherwise offensive content.
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  #15  
Old 2006-12-03, 14:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claudio View Post
I can't see why you would instantly reject a piece of software following that line of reasoning.
It's exactly the same principle as is applied by the media - you've probably noticed that your local newspapers and TV stations cover minor events in your country that they would never even think of mentioning if they took place overseas. Should they judge events by their importance rather than where they took place? No, because people are more interested in things that affect their own communities.

Like it or not, the skills required to create original games are subtly different from the skills required to translate existing games, and consequently different communities grow up around each activity, even though participants in the two activities have many common interests. People here are interested in hearing about every single translation release, but not necessarily in every last original game; and people at places like the Lemmasoft forums are interested in hearing about every single release by a member of their community, but may not be interested in every last demo translation.

Why is it unreasonable for the different sites to use different criteria to decide which releases to tell their different readerships about?

Last edited by Haeleth; 2006-12-03 at 14:35.
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